Pulsen

[Insane Steve]

I'm not exactly complaining, but the largest thing on the song selection screen is obviously a caricature of the step-artist. If it weren't larger by such a large margin I'd think "cool". Now I think "well, it speaks to priorities".

Funny thing is, that while I wasn't wholly being serious with my very first post in the thread, there was a reason for it. There would be methods to my madness, except for the lack of methods part.

[Saturn2888]

Hey all! Thanks for your input!

Ah, wish I'd known there was another, closer style. Whatever that looks like, switch to that as your default instead

That vivid-style noteskin is for new players, but you’ll be able to set the default to anything you like next patch.

Change the noteskins.

What’s your ideal noteskin design? We’re open to more suggestions.

[Insane Steve]

Hmmmmmm, something that looks more like an actual arrow than an egg, or at least makes it a lot easier to see which direction it's pointing. It's also too flashy in general. If there's going to be varied bgs (and with the gfx work done so far I can't see why there aren't) they'll blend into the background a lot (a complaint even in the old DDR days). Something with a more solid yet less gaudy color scheme and a more direct "point" to the direction. A combination of the shape and colors make it actually very difficult to see how far apart the arrows are at times due to their roundness.

I'd try and draw something but I'm like the last person you want doing art assets.

[Saturn2888]

Pulsen doesn't seem to have a mac build

Sorry about that. We're trying our hardest to get one out by the next release.

It's also too flashy in general.

Is it just the Emphin style or the Bolden one as well?

If there's going to be varied bgs (and with the gfx work done so far I can't see why there aren't) they'll blend into the background a lot (a complaint even in the old DDR days).

Do you mean backgrounds when playing songs and the noteskins blending in with them so you can't see 'em?

I'd try and draw something but I'm like the last person you want doing art assets.

Are there any particular noteskins you prefer to use that you'd like to reference?

[Saturn2888]

Pulsen doesn't seem to have a mac build

Sorry about that. We're trying our hardest to get one out by the next release.

As of just now, the Mac build works. The few of us that have Macs are testing it out. It will be ready when the next pack is released so you'll get a chance at it too!

[Morphal]

I've seen Pulsen mentioned here and on other forums, and I'm kind of wondering why so many people are saying it's a bad idea. I think more dance games is always a good idea--surely there'll come a time when I'll become bored of rhythm games, but the more things there are out there in the genre, the longer that will take to happen. And in the worst case, if I really don't enjoy a game, I can just ignore it/not play it.

What I really don't understand though is why other dance games seem to get a pass, but not Pulsen. Could someone please clarify? I'd hate to see this game go away without getting a real chance. Like I said, I think more dance games being around is a good thing.

StepMania is good because...you can run it on your computer and add whatever songs you want to it? I agree with that. But isn't it basically DDR on your computer with the ability to add songs--is that only OK because the game and content is completely free of charge? Even if you use songs which the original artist never intended to be distributed for free? I realize that it's popular on the internet to obtain for free music that is supposed to cost money, but that doesn't make it "right".

Why is ITG acceptable, but not Pulsen? Aren't they both based on the StepMania engine and have different themes, noteskins, and song lists than StepMania has? Remember that everything in Pulsen except for (most of!) the songs/stepcharts is available for the low price of zero dollars. For ITG, you have to buy the entire game with the songs and charts--otherwise you have none of it. I've also seen people complain that Pulsen is "StepMania with a different theme" or something, but if that's what you think it is, then this "StepMania with a different theme" is free, just like the other ones!

I'd really like to see this game go somewhere...if it really deserves to be ridiculed then do it, but don't treat it unfairly if it doesn't deserve it. And from what I can tell, unless someone can clarify why it should be treated any differently from the other dance games, then it seems like it's getting a lot of bad attention that it doesn't deserve. I feel a little sad that the dance game community isn't as popular as it once was, and I'd hate for anyone else to avoid trying to do anything to help revitalize it in this way or others based on the responses they've seen about Pulsen so far.

Finally, a couple of quotes I saw along the way that I felt like I should comment on to show that I've read the thread:

"...what we consider, the best charts ever made..."

I fixed the quote for you to make it more in-context. Surely you have your favorite song(s) too, right? Everyone does. It's an opinion.

As long as DDR, ITG, PIU, SM5, FFR and Dance Central exist, there is no market for what you're trying to sell.

Several dance games exist, including some that cost money and have people buying them? Maybe I don't understand what you mean, but to me that sounds like there most certainly is a market for dance games.

[SM MaxX]

StepMania is good because...you can run it on your computer and add whatever songs you want to it? I agree with that. But isn't it basically DDR on your computer with the ability to add songs--is that only OK because the game and content is completely free of charge? Even if you use songs which the original artist never intended to be distributed for free? I realize that it's popular on the internet to obtain for free music that is supposed to cost money, but that doesn't make it "right".

God no. SM is MUCH more than DDR on a computer.
And yes, we are supposedly scumbags for wanting free stuff. Welcome to the Internet. :V
We'd probably pay for it if we were interested and it looked appealing, but so far on here no one's biting (for reasons specified throughout this thread).

Why is ITG acceptable, but not Pulsen? Aren't they both based on the StepMania engine and have different themes, noteskins, and song lists than StepMania has? Remember that everything in Pulsen except for (most of!) the songs/stepcharts is available for the low price of zero dollars.

A major thing is that no Pulsen machines exist, whereas hundreds of dedicabs are waiting at our disposal. Sure it'd be cheaper maybe to buy a dance pad and just play at home, but the ITG community is mostly centered on the 14~25 age range (or something like that); people who say arcades are a part of their current life. It would be pretty difficult to convince everyone to play at home instead (especially with all the other rhythm games out there, which I'll get to in this post).
Plus, have you seen the dance pad market lately? You'd be lucky to find a CF now.

For ITG, you have to buy the entire game with the songs and charts--otherwise you have none of it. I've also seen people complain that Pulsen is "StepMania with a different theme" or something, but if that's what you think it is, then this "StepMania with a different theme" is free, just like the other ones!

I don't even want to touch this.

I'd really like to see this game go somewhere...if it really deserves to be ridiculed then do it, but don't treat it unfairly if it doesn't deserve it. And from what I can tell, unless someone can clarify why it should be treated any differently from the other dance games, then it seems like it's getting a lot of bad attention that it doesn't deserve. I feel a little sad that the dance game community isn't as popular as it once was, and I'd hate for anyone else to avoid trying to do anything to help revitalize it in this way or others based on the responses they've seen about Pulsen so far.

We've offered constructive criticism throughout this thread, which is why we're ridiculing it in the first place. There's probably a reason why it's getting treated like it is.

Finally, a couple of quotes I saw along the way that I felt like I should comment on to show that I've read the thread:

"...what we consider, the best charts ever made..."

I fixed the quote for you to make it more in-context. Surely you have your favorite song(s) too, right? Everyone does. It's an opinion.

We're not even discussing song choice. We're discussing stepcharts (and considering the fact that we are known throughout the ITG community as the most elitist group of simfilers on the web, I think we probably know what we're talking about).

As long as DDR, ITG, PIU, SM5, FFR and Dance Central exist, there is no market for what you're trying to sell.

Several dance games exist, including some that cost money and have people buying them? Maybe I don't understand what you mean, but to me that sounds like there most certainly is a market for dance games.

By "market" he means that there's no way this game could compete with any of them. Konami, ITG, and PIU pretty much dominate arcade rhythm games, SM and FFR dominate computer play, Dance Central is a major game for dancing games on the Wii (?), etc. These games have been here for years; they've improved for years, so unless Pulsen absolutely blows our minds in every way shape or form, no one's gonna play it.

[Morphal]

A major thing is that no Pulsen machines exist, whereas hundreds of dedicabs are waiting at our disposal. Sure it'd be cheaper maybe to buy a dance pad and just play at home, but the ITG community is mostly centered on the 14~25 age range (or something like that); people who say arcades are a part of their current life. It would be pretty difficult to convince everyone to play at home instead (especially with all the other rhythm games out there, which I'll get to in this post).
Plus, have you seen the dance pad market lately? You'd be lucky to find a CF now.

OK fair enough. I was more referring to people being interested in dance games in general. But an arcade version of Pulsen would be nice.

We've offered constructive criticism throughout this thread, which is why we're ridiculing it in the first place. There's probably a reason why it's getting treated like it is.

Yeah there probably is, but I can't figure it out either.

We're not even discussing song choice. We're discussing stepcharts (and considering the fact that we are known throughout the ITG community as the most elitist group of simfilers on the web, I think we probably know what we're talking about).

My mistake in wording there--I meant the charts. Usually when I say "song" regarding a rhythm game, what I really mean is the combination of the music plus the chart. I almost went back and edited that after I posted.

By "market" he means that there's no way this game could compete with any of them. Konami, ITG, and PIU pretty much dominate arcade rhythm games, SM and FFR dominate computer play, Dance Central is a major game for dancing games on the Wii (?), etc. These games have been here for years; they've improved for years, so unless Pulsen absolutely blows our minds in every way shape or form, no one's gonna play it.

I think competition is a good thing. Can't hurt to try.

[Xythar]

ITG offered an experience you could not get on DDR at the time, such as adding mines/hands/rolls and harder charts. There was no free alternative to DDR and ITG in the arcade context, unless you count making your own Stepmania cab or something.

Pulsen offers nothing new compared to SM5, which is a free alternative. It has no reason to exist.

[Morphal]

Does the PC version of ITG have a reason to exist?

[SM MaxX]

OK fair enough. I was more referring to people being interested in dance games in general. But an arcade version of Pulsen would be nice.

Guess what age group those people are?

Yeah there probably is, but I can't figure it out either.

I'm not the one confused here.

I think competition is a good thing. Can't hurt to try.

Never said competition is a bad thing. You're just not understanding what a losing battle this really is.

Does the PC version of ITG have a reason to exist?

Yeah since this whole freaking site is dedicated to it.
EDIT: wait, ITG PC? nobody uses that anymore (it's usually 3.95/oITG people use).

[Xythar]

Does the PC version of ITG have a reason to exist?

No, not really. I never got the point of it, other than to make a few bucks from people who didn't know about Stepmania (much like this game)

Both ITG PC and Pulsen are merely locked down versions of a free product that already exists (and is much more versatile). There's no real need for them.

[Insane Steve]

In all fairness I don't get all the "there's no reason for this to exist" hate -- if people want to spend effort creating a game that's very similar to another as a commercial project, using their own resources, let them. Damn.

That said if you ask for criticisms, you're going to get that, also. Ahi se ven, as they say.

[Gpop]

The difference with ITG is that it actually brought in new things which LATER got implemented into stepmania, making it that much more original than Pulsen (mines and rolls came out in ITG and ITG2 respectively first. They were later added into Stepmania) but the NEXT biggest reason is that ITG has become the best pad you could get when they allowed custom songs.

Sure you could get a pad, but nothing could beat the ITG pads. So with custom songs it allowed that access for people to play their files on that pad.

To add to that, ITG has brought the new bar to the casual gamers who only knew DDR. Before, DDR just stuck to the 10-footer scale, making players who could pass Max 300 look good, but ITG broke that barrier and made it for the hardcore gamers as well, and from that, spawned a new group of rhythm pad gamers like this one.

Pulsen just felt more like it took from SM5 and made it fancier, but in all honesty it's all something you could just get SM5 ALREADY, and offers really nothing new and original (mods were popularized I BELIEVE from Mungyodance, Insomnia series, and the WinDEU Hates You series, which all brought really original things at their time).

[Xythar]

To add to that, ITG has brought the new bar to the casual gamers who only knew DDR.

Yeah, it kind of curves in on the side